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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 8:20 pm 
Elven Warrior
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Like Gavin mentioned Maelstrom will no longer be able to sell outside of Europe on May 31st. I thought I'd just repost the announcement here, as it contains a lot of information:
Quote:
Games Workshop's new Terms and Conditions
Firstly, Games Workshop's new Terms and Conditions, which come into force on the 31st of May 2011. These, among other things, restrict the sale of language products - i.e., rulebooks and codices that are not in English - and, most crucially of all, restrict the sale of all of their products to the European Union, although there are a couple of countries (such as Norway and Switzerland) that are geographically within Europe but not in the EU that we can still sell to.

The full list of countries that we can sell GW products to is as follows:

Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Denmark, Finland, Estonia, France, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Iceland, Ireland, Italy, Latvia, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, United Kingdom

Obviously this means that all of our faithful Games Workshop customers from the Anglosphere - Australia, Canada, New Zealand and the United States - as well as those from Brazil, Chile, Peru, Russia, Japan and South Korea (apologies for those countries I have missed out) will now miss out on our superb service and cheap prices, but I'm afraid the terms and conditions of our contract with Games Workshop mean that we have to say goodbye.

Goodbye 18% UK RRP Voucher
But it's a cracking goodbye! From today until midnight (GMT) on the 30th of May all our customers will be able to use a 18% off UK RRP discount voucher code on Games Workshop products only, so you stock up on all of those items you'll need for your Warhammer, Warhammer 40,000 or Lord of the Rings armies - and of course all your paints and brushes!

The voucher will work on pre-orders and, crucially, you'll still earn Moneyback - although tiered discounts are disabled when using a voucher of course.

Your voucher code is: GW-ROW

To use this voucher simply register on the webstore, http://www.maelstromgames.co.uk (if you haven't already), copy and paste the code into the appropriate field in your basket when you have selected the items you want, press 'REDEEM', and the webstore will do the rest. You are not limited to one purchase and, indeed, we would ask you to recommend us to your friends with this voucher!

Remember though that this voucher will only work on Games Workshop products - specifically, Warhammer Fantasy Battle, Warhammer 40,000, Lord of the Rings, Citadel Hobby and Black Library products.

Phew! That should, at least, soften the blow for you all - and, of course, no other company restricts sales geographically, so you can always grab your Hordes and Warmachine and, of course, BaneLegions products from us!

Finecast
Onto other Games Workshop news. We'll shortly be stocking their superb Finecast range, which - if you didn't know already - is most of their deleted metal models, re-released in resin but somewhat more expensive than the original. Those will be on general sale on the 28th of May, for Games Workshop do not wish us to put them up for sale until then so they can keep up with demand.



Resin will be more expensive. There was talk of it possibly being cheaper...but if you look at Forge World's prices, it was probably a fool's hope to ever assume resin could be cheaper than metal.

I feel somewhat alienated from Games Workshop. LotR is under supported, North America is under supported, metals are being stopped, and prices are increasing for a large percentage of the range. I'm not saying I'm going to stop buying from GW...but there's a feeling now, more than ever, to get a few items, and get out. And even with that, I would have to really consider purchasing those items, rather than miniatures from another company, or something else entirely. What I'd really like to do is make one last diorama with LotR, and then be done with Games Workshop. But we'll see.
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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 8:36 pm 
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Ok so what does this mean? No one will be able to sell GW minis below GW's MSRRP? Well that's a load of [word deleted] and will essentially force me to scour eBay for minis.

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 8:59 pm 
Elven Warrior
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Or build a good relationship with a UK friend who can order from maelstrom and post out to you...
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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 9:05 pm 
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cereal_theif wrote:
Or build a good relationship with a UK friend who can order from maelstrom and post out to you...


I have tons of family out there, but the free shipping worldwide was part of what makes Maelstrom so awesome!

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 12:03 am 
Elven Warrior
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Yeah, next time I'm back home, I might make a biggish order to be delivered to my mother's in Ireland.

But, really, my collection has the look of something that is in the process of being wrapped up. I think I've about two year's worth of backlog right now. Paint and paint brushes are a far bigger deal to me right now, though there's always the temptation to start "just one more army"

My painting skills have gotten sloppier - don't have access to the awesome brushes I had in Quebec, or the even more awesome ones I had before that. I've mostly been painting guys for a Dungeons and Dragons game for the last six months or so, anyway.

I don't want resin models. I don't want to pay the full GW prices, which in Canada are way out of whack with the US. I'll still stalk ebay for older collections: may as well start up my paint stripping jar again. Luckily a lot of what I'd be interested in date back to the Return of the King era, which still had production runs in the many thousands. However, there are still little units I'd love to have for completeness, from the newer ranges. Indeed, long ago I realised it was better to pay more money for a model I really wanted than less money for a model I only sort of wanted. The better model brought more joy in owning, painting and using than a half hearted one.

WOTR formations are fun and exciting, but its a lot of repetitive busy work putting them together, and the experience is a bit joyless. The outcome is nice, but imperfect. The last army I truly loved was a Mithril woodman warband about a year or two ago. I'm starting to find that painting no longer distracts me from the world enough to clear out my brain and let me write

So, really, this could be a perfect reality check. Time to wrap up the collecting, relearn how to paint, play the damn game with what I have, not with what I plan to have.

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 12:38 am 
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aelfwine wrote:
WOTR formations are fun and exciting, but its a lot of repetitive busy work putting them together, and the experience is a bit joyless.

That's how I feel about Wotr and it's what I like about SBG. I can collect a wide variety of models for SBG creating small forces and not get bored painting the same thing over and over. The most would be a box of 24, where in WOTR one usually wants 2 or 3 boxes of 24 to create a dominating formation and that gets tiring.

Btw, what part of Canada are you from?

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 12:53 am 
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From Ireland, lived in Montreal for a bit, then in *cough cough* outside Montreal, now Vancouver, and probably Montreal again next year.

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 1:07 am 
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^That's a lot of bouncing around. Too bad, would've enjoyed having a game with you. I might be heading to Ottawa.

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 2:55 pm 
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Email I recieved which now confirms GW are going for reisn:

Hey Iain,

Sorry for sending out two emails in one day, but I finally
got confirmation from my trade rep at Games Workshop about
the switch to resin miniatures.

Get all the details here:
http://www.miniwargaming.com/content/co ... etal-resin

Oh, and there is a price increase too. Click the above
link for the details!

Matthew and Dave
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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 4:48 pm 
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again, thank god for ebay

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 6:45 pm 
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Drumstick wrote:

Wow, a price increase of 20% on popular models. Time to get what I can and get out.

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 8:21 pm 
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Man...I really feel like, for the most part, this is it. I just feel so...repulsed by these actions. I can't even really afford to make a last order from Maelstrom Games before that goes into effect. I might make a couple purchases on Amazon sometime but their LotR selection has recently dwindled significantly. We'll see if GW can pull me back in for The Hobbit.

I'm kinda sad--LotR was what got me into the hobby and the only range I have been consistent with throughout. It's just not worth it anymore, I can't afford it and its such a hassle. It's time to move on mainly to historicals.

(btw the reason I can afford Amazon and not Maelstrom is due to gift cards I get...if anyone thought I was being nonsensical)
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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 8:23 pm 
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Quote:
Time to get what I can and get out.


Time for a plan and budget :!:

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 9:28 pm 
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Sacrilege83 wrote:
^And just how do you know all these statistics? Is it all based on your 20 years of experience, really? Because you sound like GW management to me just based on your last paragraph. And you're right, thanks for clearing that up, GW doesn't care about maintaining their existing fanbase, they only care about bringing in young blood that don't know any better about what's going on and the history of the hobby and they use their rich mommy's & daddy's wallets to pay for everything.

And by the way, there's a difference between being loyal and being lead around like a fool. You might be loyal to them, but GW lately has been all about $$$the Benjamins$$$. The youngsters don't know any better, and the vets are getting p-o'd by the catalogues, the prices, quality, etc. It seems like GW is not returning the loyalty, which does goes both ways.

I may be a moaner that still loves this hobby, but just admit it you're a sugar coater with almost everything you post on these boards, which I guess makes for a perfect balance of view points on here. :)


Stats on closures/profits are available to anyone because GW is a public company floated on the stock market. There's info on the GW site including messages to investors from the CEO...
Easy to find stats.
The 10/100 comment is just randomly made up to try and show that the internet community (supporters and haters togther) isn't really a large part of the GW customer base. May as well be 1/1000 or whatever.
I doubt management would even bother with forums, especially a small one such as the One Ring.

Why would a company with investors not be about the money? That's the primary reason for them existing. If there was no money to be made they may as well just close shop.
I don't think it's quite so viscious though- GW give great customer service to people and they head back into stores again and again. They give people an interest and a hobby and provide what they can for them.
I know not everybody is happy with what they get from GW, but it all depends on what the individual wants.

What would you want from GW to keep you happy?

Maybe I am a sugar coater. I feel there's enough vitriol and venom on the web that I don't need to air my gripes. I can talk about the positive things that I like about the GW hobby instead.
Discussion and debate is a good thing :D

Old Chestnut wrote:
Quote:
I think the biggest threat to the hobby are the people that constantly moan about everything GW

If I thought you meant miniature gaming, I would say that is inane. If you mean "The GW Hobby" yes it is. When you give some one good service they will remember it forever. When you give poor service the same person will tell a hundred people. Where there is smoke there is fire.


Any other wargaming company is pretty much small-fry compared to GW- they've been the ones pushing the boat for years; they're the ones introducing the majority of gamers to miniature war-gaming. If they didn;t exist I think things would be different.
I think the customer service part is like I've already said- it's different to different people. I think it's fairly impossible to keep everyone happy 100% of the time.

Old Chestnut wrote:
Quote:
Quote:
I also disagree with many of the things that GW has done but in the end, they are the ones who supply us with this great hobby!

I don't know about you but It is my Hobby not GW's. I use the miniatures I like. I use the paint I like. I game with adults. I don't tell people what models they have to use in my games.I don't tell people what games they have to play. I don't treat people like they are stupid.


Sorry, you're right, it is your hobby of course and you're free to di what you want with it.
Though GW don't tell people any of those things. When I play with friends I can use whatever models I want and play whatever games I want...

It's all personal in the end, whether you love or hate GW, the hobby, the prices, whatever. I've seen the list of this years annual price-rise and it's gulp-worthy. It'll mean that I spend less for sure. Not the same for everyone though.


Last edited by Lorizael on Tue May 17, 2011 9:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 9:35 pm 
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Old Chestnut wrote:
Quote:
Time to get what I can and get out.


Time for a plan and budget :!:

I did have a plan, I do have a budget. At the beginning it was a bi-monthly purchase of $60-$100 worth of minis. Then the rumour of metal becoming closer to reality I decided to bump it up to have my collection complete by the end of summer. Now there's a price hike by the end of this month, great... So I'll keep to my plan and hope that none of the miniatures that I want gets affected by this hike. Also that there's still metal supply of them left. This is the final straw for me in dealing with GW. I was hoping to be still buying figures from them when "The Hobbit" comes out, but by that time the single miniature of Bilbo itself will probably cost $15!

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 9:53 pm 
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Well Lorizael, you're gonna about to hear a lot more people than just me griping, moaning, and complaining. I'm sure by now you've read the Maelstrom news of GW's control not to ship out worldwide and if you've read the comments section, people are not happy. Also the rise in price, I thought the purpose of doing away with metal was to keep prices low and the hobyy affordable, I guess gamers are not going to be happy as well. In any case things are still to early to say how the hobby will shape up, but it's not looking good. Could use more of your sugar coating right now ;)

Lorizael wrote:

Old Chestnut wrote:
I don't know about you but It is my Hobby not GW's. I use the miniatures I like. I use the paint I like. I game with adults. I don't tell people what models they have to use in my games.I don't tell people what games they have to play. I don't treat people like they are stupid.

Sorry, you're right, it is your hobby of course and you're free to di what you want with it.
Though GW don't tell people any of those things. When I play with friends I can use whatever models I want and play whatever games I want...

I think what Chestnut meant was how the LOME edition or WOTR Battlehosts edition kind of dictates how you create your force. It's what I got out of it anyways. There are some people that are stingy about the rules and playing strictly by the GW book, and store tournaments/events would usually follow those regulations as well because they are the common and proper regulations. When you have friendly games you can do whatever you want of course, but when you meet up with a group for an event, it's usually the rulebook that dictates the style of play and that in turn will didctate what you purchase and create for your force.

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 3:09 am 
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Sacrilege83 wrote:
I think what Chestnut meant was how the LOME edition or WOTR Battlehosts edition kind of dictates how you create your force. It's what I got out of it anyways. There are some people that are stingy about the rules and playing strictly by the GW book, and store tournaments/events would usually follow those regulations as well because they are the common and proper regulations. When you have friendly games you can do whatever you want of course, but when you meet up with a group for an event, it's usually the rulebook that dictates the style of play and that in turn will didctate what you purchase and create for your force.


And that's a problem...how? I don't know about Battlehosts but it seems to me LOME was created to resolve issues of play balance and theming. It's their game, they can do what they want. Of all the issues to complain about GW (and there are many), this seem non-existent. Nothing is stopping anyone from doing what they want with the models or even organizing a What If tournament, where they can pit the Gondor-Goblin Alliance against Galadriel and her new pet Mumak. :)

I'm ticked at GW for plenty of reasons, mostly for jacking up prices and ignoring LotR, but the above ain't one of them.
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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 3:17 am 
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXRfsBzNYbA

Miniwargaming video CONFIRMING the news.
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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 3:38 am 
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83 I was giving general advice.Pardon me if I sounded condescending.
You are right and I agree with you about the rules. But no I mean their customer service treat us like we are stupid.

I am going to change the subject at little. I am older and more established than most of you. I am in fact retired. Taxes and the devaluing currency are the source of the price increases. Greedy politicians are to blame. Don't fall into the class warfare trap. We are all going to have to plan our lives more carefully and plan reasonable collections. I built my collection over many years and plan to collect for many more.
Don't think I am going to defend GW for a moment.I have a list of grievances they choose to ignore. I am not going to tell a hundred people I am going to tell a thousand.

Lorizael Sugar coating every thing will only result in the erosion of your credibility.


Quote:
I'm ticked at GW for plenty of reasons, mostly for jacking up prices and ignoring LotR, but the above ain't one of them.


No that is no my grievance. But I will point out that taxes and devalued currency is at the heart of our current difficulty with prices. I know you have children and have been to the grocery store. Hamburger is up 200%

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 Post subject: Re: GW have stopped making metal models
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 4:30 am 
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Old Chestnut wrote:
Lorizael Sugar coating every thing will only result in the erosion of your credibility.


Give the guy a break, he's allowed to be optimistic!
Sure, this latest issue is a massive pain for all of us, but as with most other problems it'll be absorbed in the long run.


Quote:
No that is no my grievance. But I will point out that taxes and devalued currency is at the heart of our current difficulty with prices. I know you have children and have been to the grocery store. Hamburger is up 200%


Higher taxes lower economic growth, and thereby reduce upward pressure on prices. I don't think that nor a 'devalued' currency have much at all to do with a single business altering their business plan. More like the increased cost of raw materials, shipping costs etc.
Also, prices at the grocery story may have gone up over the decades, but so have real wages.

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