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Mordor army 800 pts
http://test.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=18006		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Mouth-of-Sauron [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 11:47 am ]
Post subject:  Mordor army 800 pts
Here`s an army taking great advantage on Black Numenoreans and Shadow Lords special rule...

Nazgyl

Shadow Lord (on horse)-130pts

Barad-Dur

Orc Drummer-40pts

Minas Morgul

2xBlack Numenorean Marshal (on horse w/shield)-140pts
10xMorgul Knight-190pts
6x Morgul stlakers-90pts
35xMordor Orc-(mostly with spears and shields)-210pts

Total: 55
50%: 28
Might:6

As for tactics I think ill just try to make it across the board as quickly as possible but i have yet to decide whether i will charge with Shadow Lord, Black Marshals and Morgul Knights head on, or hold back till the orcs reach the opposite army, and then cutting opponents rear with Numenoreans :rofl: BTW im playing againts the Hight elves :rofl:
Author:  General Elessar [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 12:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
You need some archers. And more Might would be nice, but not essential.
Author:  Shadowswarm [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 12:30 pm ]
Post subject: 
1st thing, doesnt the drummers bonus only apply to orcs and warg riders?

against elves will be hard as even if ur knights get to the other side unscathed, the elves high fight will be really bad 4 u... as ur knights are expensive, and cause elves have high couage, the terror rule wont be of much use (even with the nazguls rule) so you might as well get warg riders which is cheaper, faster (drum), str 4 (makes up for not having a lance) thE only things that make the knights better is the D 6 and the terror (which wont help much), so get warg riders unless you wont to keep the theme

and get some trackers, as the archers will have a heavy toll on whoever is not in the shadowlords radius, so you can take some out (or anything else that needs killing)

as for tactics you NEED to kill those archers, or else they will spell doom for you.... so make them top priority for the cavalry

so whats the point of getting morgul stuff if the elves counter everything they are good for (fight and terror) may as well get some morranon orcs. unless you want you army to look cool and have the morgul theme.
Author:  Mouth-of-Sauron [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 12:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
So whats the point of getting morgul stuff if the elves counter everything they are good for (fight and terror) may as well get some morranon orcs. unless you want you army to look cool and have the morgul theme.


Well not quite... :no:

As you mentioned higher defense, the terror is not so essential, the point of Knights are their Lances, +1 to wound is way better than strength 4 but i do see where you are coming from... but wargs?:rofl: no no no they´ll get slaughter way too soon and instead of 10 knights i can get only 12-15 wargs? so whats the point???

and well I don´t always play for win, but for fun, but within the logic of assuming it has any chance at winning

The problem with archers is that they suck terribly and the drummer+ everyone else mounted makes m army moving 20cm-24cm and the board is max 120 cm so it would take only 4-7 turns till i reach em and since ill build my formation so wide that Shadow Lord can cover all of it from the front, hitting on 6s wont do so grave damage :rofl: I think i can spare that many orcs.... :roll:
Author:  Lord Hurin [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 2:41 pm ]
Post subject: 
One of my regular opponents plays High Elves so take it from me; you need some Morannon Orcs. Drop those Stalkers, a Marshal and swap the Orcs for a Morannon Orc Captain and a bunch of those guys.
Author:  spuds4ever [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 4:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
General Elessar wrote:
You need some archers. And more Might would be nice, but not essential.


I think that the might store is fine you're just used to having loads of might because you play Gondor a lot. And archers are not really needed if you have a cavalry force and also, Mordor have terrible archers except for trackers which are ok but have such a short range that you'll probably be in combat with your cavalry by the time you're in range.
Author:  General Elessar [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 4:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
spuds4ever wrote:
General Elessar wrote:
You need some archers. And more Might would be nice, but not essential.


I think that the might store is fine you're just used to having loads of might because you play Gondor a lot. And archers are not really needed if you have a cavalry force and also, Mordor have terrible archers except for trackers which are ok but have such a short range that you'll probably be in combat with your cavalry by the time you're in range.


Six might? It should be enough, but I'd personally take more just to be on the safe side. How about ally in a Haradrim Chieftain? Then you can also take some Haradrim archers.
Author:  Lord Hurin [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 5:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
General Elessar wrote:
Six might? It should be enough, but I'd personally take more just to be on the safe side. How about ally in a Haradrim Chieftain? Then you can also take some Haradrim archers.


Not without getting twice their numbers in troops without bows. So, if you take 12 Haradrim archers then you need 24 Haradrim without bows.
Author:  Shadowswarm [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 5:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
but if you want to get harradrim archers you need to get warriors.... then the theme is all gone and u will have less models...

so i think it will be alright if the knights can kill the archers, or mmosst of them

the morgul stalkers are nice, but getting two morranon orcs would be good (but still have a few)

you could also get some warg riders to go with the knights, so that they can get anyone who is running away, or can take a bit more time to flank around teh back and to make sure that your knights dont get swamped by all his army
Author:  General Elessar [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 5:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
Shadowswarm wrote:


you could also get some warg riders to go with the knights, so that they can get anyone who is running away, or can take a bit more time to flank around teh back and to make sure that your knights dont get swamped by all his army


Or you could just use the Warg Riders as shields... :twisted:
Author:  Mouth-of-Sauron [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 6:02 pm ]
Post subject: 
@ Lord Hurin: if I would purely (and boringly) want to WIN then i would build the entire force mostly of Morrannon orcs and trhow in a few Nazgyl... and a Drummer

But since that is not the case then I think i don´t need those two...

@spuds4ever: Well said, I couldn´t say it in any better way :rofl: :yay: 8)


As you already noted, theres no point in adding in haradrim archers as half of the Army would be build out of them in that case...

Mmm Wargs are out.... pointless, as they get slaughtered way to soon, cause of the low defence.... at least the Morgul knights have the chance to survive the 2nd fight.... and I didnt give Black marshals horses for just show... they are going to make heroic moves should the priority roll go awkward and I dont think that 2-3 warg riders would make much of a difference....

:rofl:

But i do thank you for the input :rofl:
Author:  Lord Hurin [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 7:51 pm ]
Post subject: 
Ok, let me get this straight... The only person you agree with is the one who tells you all your theories are correct? Why is this in the Army Help section if you already know you don't want to change anything?
Author:  spuds4ever [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:15 pm ]
Post subject: 
Lord Hurin wrote:
General Elessar wrote:
Six might? It should be enough, but I'd personally take more just to be on the safe side. How about ally in a Haradrim Chieftain? Then you can also take some Haradrim archers.


Not without getting twice their numbers in troops without bows. So, if you take 12 Haradrim archers then you need 24 Haradrim without bows.


Do you have to have an archer limitation even when allying with that particular force you are allying with?
Author:  Mouth-of-Sauron [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:30 pm ]
Post subject: 
Well I know that is sounded arrogant.... :lol: but ehmm


Actually I WOULD HAVE CHANGED something if It be worth it but all that you have suggested , in my experience , woun´t do me much good. Now dont get me wrong I understand all those view points above but still....

Well i do apologize if I offended you in some manner, I know i dont like those people too who post their army and try to offset every suggestion by prompting their own theories and view points.

and as i said, I thank you all so far for you input , but i dont find them that useful...(no offence)

Although I do like the army and didnt want to change any of it, the reason why I posted it here was that since I dont have that much experience with elites/lesser numbers and cavalry with Mordor , I hoped that maybe people would note some big flaws (some of which they have btw) or make some very reasonable suggestions.... :rofl:



And yes You do have a bow restriction with every ally... except the pure Grey Company :rofl:
Author:  Lord Hurin [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
spuds4ever wrote:
Do you have to have an archer limitation even when allying with that particular force you are allying with?


As per Legions of Middle-earth, yes. Each separate faction must have a Hero and no more than 1/3 bows.
Author:  spuds4ever [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:50 pm ]
Post subject: 
Lord Hurin wrote:
spuds4ever wrote:
Do you have to have an archer limitation even when allying with that particular force you are allying with?


As per Legions of Middle-earth, yes. Each separate faction must have a Hero and no more than 1/3 bows.


That's irritating :x
Author:  Lord Hurin [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 9:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
spuds4ever wrote:
That's irritating :x


It's to prevent power gaming. Like exactly the thing you were suggesting.
Author:  ncea [ Sun Apr 04, 2010 10:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
i agree with lord hurin it seems like your already well experienced with mordor or you just wont agree with anyone or even take any advice.

i think you should still try some of the ideas people have suggested even if you dont like them. then maybe start playtesting.

then start thinking what you should change..
Author:  Shadowswarm [ Mon Apr 05, 2010 3:30 am ]
Post subject: 
ok so i can understand not having wargs, but i still think that you should get some morranons in there (you can still keep the theme)

and again DOESNT THE DRUMMERS MOVEMENT BONUS ONLY APPLY TO WARG RIDERS AND ORCS..... THE BLACK NUMs DONT GET THE BONUS
so if you have the black nums supported by orcs then the black nums will slow them all down as they run to the elves...
so its going to mess up the battle line a bit

and even if you can get to him fast, getting a few trackers can never go wrong

remember this, even though you have the shadow lord it doesnt mean that the elves cant shoot his horse.....
Author:  Mouth-of-Sauron [ Mon Apr 05, 2010 4:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
Actually now that I think about it :D i think your right, I don´t know why i posted it even here, well i was a long time away from SBG but looks like I still do remember a thing or two)

Yes I am aware that the Drummer affects only Orcs, uruks, warg-riders but Morgul knight is a mounted Black Numenorean thus moving 24 cm and Morgul Stalkers are orcs aswell, so I see no problem :rofl:

Ill play the first game with this army, but I´ll take into consideration wargs and maybe eerhm (hate to even say this) trackers :lol:

But I will, once again sorry if I offended anyone :rofl:
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