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| 400 point torny isengard lists http://test.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=27490 |
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| Author: | THE-WHITE-HAND [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 6:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | 400 point torny isengard lists |
hello all! can i have some advice/criticism of my lists please? i would most likely use the last one as it is rounded and has a solid build, however you may be able to convince me otherwise as i have had no Hobbit sbg experience so far, but a lot of the old sbg. Torny lists isengard -shaman (armour) 10 Feral Uruk-hai 175 -Vrasku 5 warriors (crossbows) 115 -Captain (Heavy armour, shield) 5 Warriors (shield) 110 400 total ..................................... -Shaman (armour) 4 Warriors (shield) 2 Feral Uruk-hai Troll 224 -Vrasku 4 Warriors (crossbow) 6 Feral Uruk-hai 176 400 total ..................................... -Shaman (armour) 4 Warriors (shield) 3 Berserkers 5 Feral Uruk-hai 200 -Vrasku 4 Warriors (crossbow) 8 Feral Uruk-hai 200 400 total |
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| Author: | Isilduhrr [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
Ferals are pretty epic, better than berserkers. All these lists are pretty low in numbers. The first list seems pretty solid, but the second...you don't want a troll at this low points value. |
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| Author: | legion [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
Under the Hobbit updates, all three of your lists change minimally except for the Troll list. That troll becomes fierce but then the rest of your list is a bit too elite heavy with it. It will only take 9 losses to break you in that list. Ultimately, if you insist on bringing a shaman, which it seems you do, I would focus on a pure Uruk list to take advantage of a Channeled Fury the best. Therefore the first list or last list is the best consideration. The only reason I would go with the first list is because of the addition of an extra captian. Might is even more precious after the Hobbit update. |
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| Author: | THE-WHITE-HAND [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
so basically, dont use the list with the troll unless i can bulk out the other groups? its not so much that i insist with using a shaman, i had a look at some tactics and found the shaman favorable. i once played against uruks in a mirror match up, my opponent had 10 berserkers and a shaman, i admit that his rolls were very lucky, but he must have saved them around 6 times through the game! this combined with the fact i required a 6 to kill them, was very frustrating. i feel that 3 heroes at 400 points may be a little excessive, as valuable as might may be, as this would thin out my forces and uruk hai tend to be elite armies anyway. if i were playing an infantry based orc army for example, i would perhaps consider a tide of dudes in three groups. what are your opinions on a more warrior based list, giving mostly shields to them meaning its a 6 in most cases to kill? add a shaman for some lucky saves, throw a few feral uruk hai in there for extra dice and a sprinkle of berserkers.HOWEVER, what about an allied group of corsair reavers? their fight is that of elves, giving an edge when fighting against higher fight value armies and a HUGE edge against armies with the same fight as my uruk hai such as dwarves. |
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| Author: | JamesR [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
I actually like your second list with a few modifications. I'd dump most if not all the Ferals for normal Uruks with sword, they are good but a few more models are definitely worth it, and a monster at that point level will devastate if used correctly. But that takes a deft hand lol so practice before the tourney |
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| Author: | legion [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 10:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
Yeah if your going to use a troll, then you need to have a lot more men to expand your breaking point. Otherwise, your opponent can just ignore the troll and kill everything else, allowing your courage 3 troll to just leave you when your broken, especially since he doesn't benefit from fury. Therefore, in order to effectively use the troll, you need JamesR's idea of taking out the Feral Uruks and adding regulars to boost numbers. Then the Troll will cause serious problems, since at 400pts its very unexpected and difficult to deal with. As for the Shaman, I completely agree that he is awesome for a Uruk list. Im just saying that the second list benifets from him the least. Also, your third list does not actually have that much might since the Shaman will be using his for Fury. |
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| Author: | THE-WHITE-HAND [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 11:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
I think having a troll at such low points is probably not great, at 500 or more it may be more suitable. However, even if I get rid of the feral, I will only be able to get 2 more warriors. And that's if I convert the crossbow guys to shields too. So although swapping feral for warriors, even though this would improve durability, it would reduce my attacking power and only improve my breaking point by 1. The new list would be -shaman Troll 9 warriors (shield) -Captain (shield) 9 Warriors (shield) I thought the shaman uses a point of will to cast fury, and if he gets it, he has it for the rest of the game unless he loses all his will?? |
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| Author: | Galanur [ Fri Jan 17, 2014 12:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
Shaman is very nice if you want to explore just uruk hai lists youre doing a good job, although if you want isen mix Consider Thrydan wolfsbane, he cost a bit more than an uruk hai captain with defence 7 but alot more punch on might/will/fate store, also he cause 2 wounds rather than 1 per attack that sucessfully wound a target. He can kill 2 wound models very quickly(rank and fill captains drop like mud to this guy for example), in which on horse he would be better (cause he gains +1A vs foot models) and so on, hes very decent at basic already...ohh and he got 12" stand fast for a model for his cost... |
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| Author: | rumtap [ Fri Jan 17, 2014 5:50 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
THE-WHITE-HAND wrote: I thought the shaman uses a point of will to cast fury, and if he gets it, he has it for the rest of the game unless he loses all his will?? Yes but if the shaman spends a might point he can cast channeled fury and improve the spell from a 6 save to a 5 or 6 save. Very very very useful. |
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| Author: | THE-WHITE-HAND [ Fri Jan 17, 2014 9:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
Galanur wrote: Shaman is very nice if you want to explore just uruk hai lists youre doing a good job, although if you want isen mix Consider Thrydan wolfsbane, he cost a bit more than an uruk hai captain with defence 7 but alot more punch on might/will/fate store, also he cause 2 wounds rather than 1 per attack that sucessfully wound a target. He can kill 2 wound models very quickly(rank and fill captains drop like mud to this guy for example), in which on horse he would be better (cause he gains +1A vs foot models) and so on, hes very decent at basic already...ohh and he got 12" stand fast for a model for his cost... I REALLY like this idea and have made a list around it that has more staying power than the other lists because of the higher number of warriors and berserkers that come along with the shaman who will hopefully give then a 5+ save after that too. -Shaman 8 warriors (shield) 4 berserkers 195 - Thrydan Worlfsbane 6 warriors (shield) 5 feral Uruk hai 205 400 total Could I have any advice on if I were to change this list to a 500 point list? Should I add a troll or bulk out my two forces OR reduce the numbers of guys in each squad and create a third? If so what should I add? Perhaps some corsair reavers? |
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| Author: | THE-WHITE-HAND [ Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
How about this...??? -Shaman (armour) 7 warriors (shield) 3 berserkers 45 170 - Thrydan Worlfsbane 5 warriors (shield) 5 feral Uruk hai 195 -Corsair captain (shied) 8 corsair reavers 135 500 total |
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| Author: | Galanur [ Sat Jan 18, 2014 1:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
Try this 400pts list Isengard army 400pts Thrydan Wolfsbane 6 uruk hai warriors with shield 1 berserker 1 feral uruk hai Uruk hai shaman 5 uruk hai warriors with shield 2 feral uruk hai Vrasku 4 uruk hai crossbows 400pts might: 7 models: 22 break on: 11 for 500pts add: Mauhur 4 uruk hai with shield giving total: 10 might 27 models breaking on 14 What you think? OR 400pts of this: Vrasku 5 uruk hai with crossbow Thyrand Wolfsbane 6 Isengard orcs with shield 6 Isengard orcs with spear Mauhur 5 Isengard orcs with shield 6 Isengard orcs with spear total: 398pts might: 9 models: 31 break on 16 a more horde type of army with really alot might in it.... |
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| Author: | THE-WHITE-HAND [ Sun Jan 19, 2014 7:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 400 point torny isengard lists |
very interesting lists, i was hoping to go for the pure isengard elite kind of build, not ruling out the ever so helpful arrow fodder that are orcs of corse, however, could you please perhaps explain how important might is over the force? if i had for example, 4 warbands of around 6 orcs each with a total of 7 might, effectivly spamming might at the cost of unit quality, how would this fair against fewer warbands say, 2 fully loaded elite uruk hai warbands with 4 might? im interested as to the implications of favoring might quantity for warband quality? |
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