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| WotR, bat swarms charging http://test.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=19764 |
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| Author: | Shadowswarm [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 2:13 am ] |
| Post subject: | WotR, bat swarms charging |
bat swarms are in a square base so would normally only be able to charge in front of them, but the rules say they charge like a flying monster and the rules say that flying monsters can see all around them and so can charge in any direction (pg 42, 2nd paragraph in #3 choose target) so do they charge with normal vision, or can they charge in any direction? |
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| Author: | jscottbowman [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 5:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
My gut reaction, would be to allow it to charge as per flying monster, thus in any direction. It is after all a "cloud of bats", and I don't really see such a thing having a specific facing, rear or flanks for that matter. That's just my thoughts regards Scott |
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| Author: | hithero [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 7:48 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
Bats need to follow all the rules laid down, they can't charge in any direction as only monsters on round bases can. |
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| Author: | Shadowswarm [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
well the rules can be interpreted in either way... |
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| Author: | hithero [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 6:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
1)The rule for flying monster charging is that it can fly over enemy. page 34. 2)The rule for round 'individual' monster bases is that they can move/see in any direction. Bats only follow the first criteria, they are neither individuals or on round bases, can't see how this can be interretated any other way. |
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| Author: | Xelee [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 7:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
1. All formations, Monsters or otherwise actually have 360 movement. You just need to ensure no corner of a base moves too far. 2. Some monsters are on round bases, no corners = no problems with one moving further than others. 3. Some monsters are not on round bases, oval ones are specifically mentioned in the rules, but the general principle applies (since it applies to all movement). Move in any direction and ensure no corner moves too far. 4. Where facing does matter is in the shoot (not applicable here), charge and fight phases. 5. Nothing in the unit rules mention exceptions to the fight phase, and the formation type is actually 'cavalry'. So they will suffer flanking penalties. 6. As to charging: The formation charges like a flying monster and "Monsters and Flying Monsters can see all around them, so can charge in any direction." Cheers *spelling* |
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| Author: | hithero [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 8:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
But they can only see all round to charge/shoot if on round bases, bats do not qualify for that rule so they can only charge to the front. The rules are in seperate places and are not linked at all. |
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| Author: | Xelee [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 8:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
Hi Hithero, I gave you the actual quoted rule and have looked through each step, as I see it. If other rules contradict this, please give the quotes and/or page refs (if page refs, I'll have to check tonight). Cheers |
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| Author: | hithero [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 10:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
The box-out on page 37 " As they fight as Individuals...monsters have a 360' arc of sight." Bats are not individuals so should use the normal arc of sight rules. Monsters are by default on round or oval bases, mounted singally. Page 34 Tells us that flyers can fly over models and terrain for movement. This is to seperate rules on different pages, arc of sight and moving are not linked. The Flock of Doom rule on page 183 (bats) tells us that they 'move and charge like a flying monster.' Move & charge; not move, charge and arc of sight. Bats are not monsters. |
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| Author: | Xelee [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 11:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
Fair enough Hithero, I didn't see that the rulebook specified individuals only for Monster arc of sight. |
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| Author: | jscottbowman [ Tue Nov 23, 2010 5:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
hithero wrote: The Flock of Doom rule on page 183 (bats) tells us that they 'move and charge like a flying monster.' Move & charge; not move, charge and arc of sight. Bats are not monsters. Interesting point. I'll have to watch this. Going to use the bats for the first time this weekend... |
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| Author: | Hashut's Blessing [ Tue Nov 23, 2010 1:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: WotR, bat swarms charging |
Seems a little late, but I would've also pointed out that it says that they move and charge like flying monsters, but have the arc of sight of cavalry. Thusly, within their frontal arc, they may charge as a monster... |
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