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| Serpent Guard http://test.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=31706 |
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| Author: | jdizzy001 [ Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Serpent Guard |
I was looking over the serpent guard profile yesterday and I am not convinced. Unless one is building a themed Suladan army, I can't think of a reason to field the serpent guard when one can just as easily field watchers of Karna (for better fight value) or haradrim raiders (for cavalry). What can you teach me about the serpent guard that I am missing? |
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| Author: | Wan Shi Tong [ Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
Because they let you have fight four support from the back rank which allows you to faint with your front ranks, plus they always get to reroll one with poison. For horsemen the extra fight can make or break a cav unit when it attacks. The fact that they can outfight a number of common mounted units makes them better then the raiders. |
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| Author: | jdizzy001 [ Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
Sure, but I can field watcher's of Karna instead and the only thing I would be missing is the extra movement from cavalry. |
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| Author: | Arthas367 [ Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
Well I will throw a few points out, since Harad is the main evil army I play. Watchers of Karna, - Most likely taken with bow which makes the 2 points higher than our Serpent Guard, and means you will not always be throwing them immediately into the fray. - 2 Attacks which is huge - Resist Magic is icing Serpent Guard - Cheaper points cost wise, also brings that F4 - Come with a spear for backline support - Poison, on a melee weapon, which is very nice ( same with watchers bow) they both synergize well with The Betrayer, and I think they both have a great place ( though the only reason the subject comes up on Watchers Favor, is that they are widely accepted to be under point costed) Harad really packs some of the best infantry in the game imo ( they have such a huge variety) , so toy with them and figure out what works for your playstyle. |
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| Author: | Coenus Scaldingus [ Wed Dec 23, 2015 9:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
Are you talking about Serpent Guard or Riders? You mention the former, but then also talk of Haradrim Raiders. The only thing that is sensibly compared to Serpent Guard are Haradrim Warriors with spear. All other figures fill a completly different role - archers, frontline fighters, cavalry. There is little reason to take Serpent Guard in the front rank, as Abrakhan Guard or Watchers of Karna are of more use there. Spear support is never a bad thing, however, and F4 with poison rather useful at that (if the first rank is F4 as well, it can now Feint while retaining the Fight value in the duel). As cavalry, the Serpent Riders are certainly better than Raiders with war spear, as those have no way of being F4 (and F3 really doesn't cut most of the time). The latter are good as mounted archers, mind you, but that's a different story again. |
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| Author: | jdizzy001 [ Wed Dec 23, 2015 4:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
Yeah, a fight 4 cavalry is good. I can't think of a reason to field them without a horse. |
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| Author: | Wan Shi Tong [ Wed Dec 23, 2015 6:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
Harad has four troop types capable of supporting, haradrim warriors, serpent guard, corsairs and mahud warriors. Of those four only two have fight 4 and only one has strength 4 though they do not overlap. The corsair and serpent guard have almost the exact same stat line, save that the serpent guard come with armor, a spear and poison for one point more then a corsair basic. The corsair gets throwing weapons and can buy both a spear and a shield to even up with the serpent guard, though it becomes more expensive. Plus the corsair can take a bow rather then a shield and could shoot if you need to. What it comes down to is whether you can use throwing weapons and shielding from your back rank more then you could use poison. The superiority of one over the other will come down to play style. But the serpent guard is not rendered obsolete by the existence of any other harad unit for the purpose of support. |
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| Author: | Coenus Scaldingus [ Wed Dec 23, 2015 7:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
No 50% bows when taking Far Harad or Corsairs though (theme also takes a hit in those cases), which is why I won't normally consider them to be true alternatives. |
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| Author: | jdizzy001 [ Thu Dec 24, 2015 6:35 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
So the serpent guard is more of a support unit? That actually helps clear up some things in my head. The spear should have given that away, but it didnt |
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| Author: | Dikey [ Thu Dec 24, 2015 11:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
jdizzy001 wrote: I was looking over the serpent guard profile yesterday and I am not convinced. Unless one is building a themed Suladan army, I can't think of a reason to field the serpent guard when one can just as easily field watchers of Karna (for better fight value) or haradrim raiders (for cavalry). What can you teach me about the serpent guard that I am missing? Actually, I think they are excellent cavalry units. F4 and lances makes them really useful, and for a relatively cheap price. When charging, they are more effective than their rohirrim counterparts. And even as foot soldiers, they are not bad at all. I've seen them fielded behind Watchers of Karna when lines clash for a total of 3 attacks rerolling ones at fight four. Of course, they are quite fragile, but that's a problem with the whole harad and umbar list. |
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| Author: | LordoftheBrownRing [ Fri Dec 25, 2015 5:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
Yeah I understand they are good as well but I was confused as to why everyone loved them that much. They're pretty darn good but not amazing. You def don't need them for an effective army and I think their best trait is becoming a rider not on foot. |
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| Author: | Arthas367 [ Fri Dec 25, 2015 11:43 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serpent Guard |
Well I think many people like them for a variety of reasons, rules not always being number 1, which is far from uncommon, they are nice models to look at, and very synergistic with the Betrayer and Watchers/ Archers/ S. Riders. Though rule wise they arE pretty good in my opinion and allow for a great support unit to back up Black Numenoreans, Watchers, or just a Harad warrior bare (for a nice cheap 2 man combo), I'm sure theirs plenty of other great options, much further expanded by the fact other evil factions wouldn't mind a f4 guy supporting them with a spear for fairly cheap. |
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